Monday, September 29, 2008


Yeah, this was all the Republicans fault...

The conscience of the congress? - Bad for Obama...


Voltron said...

Hope I didn't step on your toes here FF, but I thought this was important.

(it also dovetails nicely into your post)

Freedom Fan said...

Wow, Volt. What an indictment of the crooked, greedy Libs. I hope this video goes viral in time to save the country from the Obamanation.

Voltron said...

I was just telling the libs FF, that I liked Newt's plan:

1. Fire Paulson.

2. Suspend "mark to market" for a two week trial. Make it permanent IF it works. (the SEC could do this tomorrow morning before the bell, congress is not needed)

3. NO giveaways. Make it a loan that they have to pay back over a period of years.

4. Make them take out insurance on the loans at treasury + 2%.

5. (this one's mine) Implement Shays call in 2004 to give regulators more power over freddie/fannie.

(Bart's 401k is shrinking faster than a hemroid on peparation H. Even he'd go for it now...LOL)

BTW, I'm not as worried about Obama as I once was. From what I'm seeing I don't think he's got a very good chance.

The AOL straw poll is showing McCain at over 60% and has been for quite a long time.
And AOL polls usually go VERY liberal...

clif said...

Newt's plan was this:

1. Fire Paulson.

Why he wasn't at Treasury when the problem was created, John Snow was, just like Ben Bernanke wasn't at the FED Alan Greenspan was.

I suppose firing Bernanke will undo Greenspan's damage also?

Firing Paulson won't help because then you gotta STOP everything and hold hearings to get a replacement, which means NOT until after the election, when congress returns, 5 weeks from now when the economy would have been flushed and sliding down the sewers,

Talk about creating havoc in the markets, the firing of Paulson at this time would be sending nuclear signals to Wall Street, with everyone dumping as fast as they can.

BTW who they gonna get as a replacement?

Phil Gramm?

Newt is dumber then a box of rocks on this one.

He hasn't given a very good start for his very partisan dumb approach.

2. Suspend "mark to market" for a two week trial.

Right go BACK to fairy tale land so the economic crisis can be covered up AGAIN like it was during most of Bush's time in incompetence in office.

Make it permanent IF it works. (the SEC could do this tomorrow morning before the bell, congress is not needed)

Hiding the truth ALWAYS works for the right wing. Mark to market forces the sellers to admit the REAL worth of what they have, Newt's approach allows the lies and deception which got us here in the first place to continue.

3. NO giveaways.

Good KBR, Halliburton, Carlyle, GE, Boeing, General Dynamics, Blackwater can start giving back their give-aways too. Then all the Bush cronies and Cheney cronies, followed by the free handouts the right wing congress gave to K Street. That would produce "enuf" money to bail out the mess and settle quite a bit of the debt.

Make it a loan that they have to pay back over a period of years.

Well the fed is "loaning" as much money as they can, and things ain't recovering because it isn't a lack of liquidity in the markets, it is the lack of confidence or trust between banks which has caused this crisis.

No bank TRUSTS another bank because of the fairy tale CDO's SIV's and credit swaps they hold, the "bailout" was supposed to remove THAT and restore confidence.

But republicans don't seem to understand this for some reason, other wise they wouldn't be fighting for something which won't work.

4. Make them take out insurance on the loans at treasury + 2%.

You CAN'T have insurance without the real VALUE of what is being insured being known, thus this idea is in DIRECT contradiction to the second idea, but then again consistency was never Newt's strong point, and his cheating while trying to impeach the Clenis for cheating shows in spades.

BTW a loan at 2% is a give away, given the toxic nature of the holdings the banks have. Then again it is Newt's slimy attempt at MORE corporate welfare.

and now for the dumb idea duncetron came up with;

5. (this one's mine) Implement Shays call in 2004 to give regulators more power over freddie/fannie.

So the Bush crony can IGNORE this regulation just like they ignored the rest,

Like Greenspn REFUSED the call in 1994 to regulate mortgages which would have prevented ALL OF THIS?

Fannie and Freddie DIDN'T create the SIV,s, CDO's or credit swaps, which are at the heart of the crisis, it is a dishonest reich wing talking point which coming from YOU is expected.

The banks refused to do their JOB and decide which loans were good and which should never happen because they could use SIV's CDO's and credit default swaps to sell the toxic junk to others and set up more loans by REFUSING to do due diligence.

See the banks have to APPROVE the loans, which means they could heave prevented the entire mess if they did their job in the first place, OR Greenspan had set regulations which prevented them from refusing to do their job.

BUT Nooooo, the reich wing wants the lassie fair attitude to be dominant which meant NOBODY was watching to make sure good loans got done and bad ones rejected.

Thus the republican mantra is the root of this mess and NEWT was the main force for much of it when it happened.

Nice try at spinnin' reich wing talking point of the day.

The real problem rests in he amount of money tied up in credit default swaps which DWARF's the sub prime mess by more than a magnitude of 10.

In the US, the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency reported the notional amount on outstanding credit derivatives from reporting banks to be $16.4 trillion at the end of March, 2008.


The value of U.S. subprime mortgages was estimated at $1.3 trillion as of March 2007,

The credit default swaps were a good" idea as long as prices rose because the default couldn't happen because the value rose against the obligations so every one made money and nobody called for full payment.

Once the sub-prime collapse started the CDS started losing their "value" but the obligation was still there.

United States non-financial private debt is $32.4 trillion dollars and household debt is $10.0 trillion as of 2Q 2008. This encompasses mortgages, auto loans, credit cards, HELOCs, commercial and industrial loans, LBO monies outstanding and all other forms of non-financial (e.g. not including margin loans and similar) debt.

Lots of this debt is starting to go bad because the slow down is starting to affect everyone.

Remember world derivative contracts have passed 370 trillion dollars, and the banks don't know who hold nuclear levels debt vs just toxic levels of debt.

The bailout would have started to fix the mess but;

If, as many have projected, the actual losses to be sustained are $2.5-3 trillion in residential housing and a like amount among commercial real estate, credit cards and LBO loans, then the aggregate requirement is not $700 billion it is in the neighborhood of five to nine times what has been requested

Now compare the projected losses to the CDO debt which is turning toxic at best, and you might understand why;

Yes, we needed the bailout to start cleaning it up, BUT much more is needed.

Either a Japan style deliberate funding of the economy for years until it can be unwound, or even a return to the FDR approach, ALL OF IT.

The alternate is going to make the great depression seem mild by comparison.

However, the republicans are fighting tooth and nail against, they know if we have to accept the Japan model or return to the FDR style approach they will be revealed as the charlatans they always were.

Because then they have nothing but bible thumping and Bomb, Bomb, Bomb to run their campaigns on ....... and broke Americans won't "buy" that.

Freedom Fan said...

Volt, Newt Gingrich was demonized unmercifully by the leftists, because he was the most effective leader and spokesman for the Conservative movement since Reagan.

Gingrich was the one primarily responsible for the dramatic prosperity of the 1990s. Gingrich, the freshmen Congressmen, and the Contract For America swept into power in 1994 in response the Clinton mess.

If you look at charts of GDP growth and stock market performance, you find that it all began at that moment in 1994.

The financial community responded instantly to what they saw as the return of responsible adult leadership to the decades of corrupt dominance by Liberals led by douchbags like Tip O'Neill.

If Gingrich were still in power, imagine how much better off the U.S. would be right now.

Now Americans are about to reject leadership of another wise, patriotic, experienced maverick, John McCain.

Instead they will install a woefully inexperienced, America-hating, Marxist lawyer to run the erstwhile most powerful nation on Earth.

As with Hoover's and Roosevelt's response to the crash of 1929, Obama's response will be the opposite of what is required. Instead of encouraging and cultivating the confidence of the captains of industry, Obama will punish them with taxation, lawsuits and regulation as the economy falls into a full retreat. All the while rabid leftists like clippy, will be screaming for more blood from their victims -- the only ones who could save us with their innovations and willingness to take risk.

The fragile U.S. economy is in for a long hard journey; manage your affairs accordingly, my friend.

Voltron said...

Gingrich = Agreed.

McCain = Uh, I'm voting for Palin.

McCain only happens to be along for the ride...

Obama = Don't think he'll win.

Cliffy = No bets.

clif said...

I see you two chicken shit CLOWNS can't refute what I posted so you rely of your tired old but-buddy act again.

Anonymous said...

Sorry about the delay. I was ordered to an insignificant little third world country to attend the retirement of a member of it's government. I won't be grilling him like the moose and owls. He didn't look as tasty. To top it off, I think he shat himself towards the end. The Middle Easterners talk a good game, until they're lashed to a post with razor wire. I suppose that would take the wind out of anyone's sails. It would seem they're not at all as interested in meeting Allah and the virgins as they would lead us to believe. Who knew?

Thank you too Cliff. I can't get as mushy with you as I did Sara for what I would hope would be obvious heterosexual reasons. But I do thank you for wasting the keystroke time as well.

It's not all I need, but it's a good start.

I will ask you one favor however. BFF? Dude! Don't throw teenage girl text message abbreviations at me. That's just....insulting.

I don't think I'll screw with Cornell's blog Voltron. After a few years of lurking here, I've read enough to know that she tends to delete that which doesn't please her. I can almost guarantee that I can't please her. Perhaps Sara could lend a finger....I mean, a hand. I'll bet I know what finger she'll lend me now. And poor Lydia. The whole hand? Well, maybe it'll lighten her up a bit. Maybe Sara has small hands.

Ooooo. I just got a shiver. Where's my lotion?

You guys make me look forward to actually formulating a political opinion.

clif said...

eddyPUSS wanna try it with out Voltron's hand shoved up your ass making your mouth move?

clif said...

Quinnipiac University – “Obama Over 50 Percent In Florida, Ohio, Pennsylvania,

FLORIDA: Obama 51 – McCain 43 post-debate

OHIO: Obama 50 – McCain 42 post-debate

PENNSYLVANIA: Obama 54 – McCain 39 post-debate

nuff said .........

Will "take no prisoners" Hart said...

Barney Rubble was more likable than this guy.

Anonymous said...

"eddyPUSS wanna try it with out Voltron's hand shoved up your ass making your mouth move?"

See. That was a good one. I actually laughed until I had tears in my eyes over that. I was expecting someone to go for the woman pleasing thing. I didn't even once think of that angle.

You nailed two people with as many sentences. Brilliant.

I can see why Voltron likes arguing with you so much.

Will "take no prisoners" Hart said...

I think Bartlebee might have hurt Cliffmeister's feelings. The latter seems to have taken a sabbatical from his LC rantings. Must really hurt to have been dissed by a comrade.

thereturnofRusty said...

My goodness,I go away for a few days and look at this talk.

Klink wants to shove Volts hand up eddypusses ass? What with that?I know Klink had that little "problem" while in the service but you would think the years spent with a court appointed analyst might have cured him of these wayward thoughts.I guess not....back to the couch Klink.

clif said...

Glad you liked it eddyPUSS,

I guess dolty's other puppet don't like the competition.